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General => General topics => Topic started by: MT on July 29, 2009, 06:16:07 PM

Title: Moving on to grain.
Post by: MT on July 29, 2009, 06:16:07 PM
Well, I've been enjoying this hobby for almost a year now and have finally purchased a PC. I have read so many posts about grain usage and have gotten fairly good at casing BRF cakes that I believe it's time to expand my knowlodge of this science. I can't wait for my new equipment to arrive.  I will be using WBS with Texas strain for my first attempt. Will continue to update as my new experiment progresses.
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on July 29, 2009, 06:24:37 PM
MT,
  Piece of cake!    :rolleyes:  Have fun with it,....
   ~Malabar   :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fattrout on July 29, 2009, 09:07:46 PM
go for it MT, you may never go back to BRF cakes. -_-
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: MT on August 03, 2009, 04:18:10 PM
My PC arrived on Saturday. By Saturday night I had six quarts of WBS cooling down and I inoculated them With 2 cc's of Texas strain each on Sunday. I have used the search function here trying to answer a couple of questions with no positive results. So, here are my questions: How long after inoculation do I wait to shake the jars? Also Approx. how long until they will be completely colonized? Thanks everyone!
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 03, 2009, 04:46:15 PM
MT,
  You certainly gave those jars a healthy dose, eh?   :rolleyes: Congrats on your new endeavor. 
  I wouldn't worry too much about shaking them, at least not now.    WBS, and millet colonize quite rapidly and pretty much completely, w/o much help at all.  Since this was LC, it will probably be a few days before the initial signs appear, after which you will have to monitor the progress.
  If you would like to "spread the news" and speed things up, I would wait until you are at  least 50% colonized. Then shake them and let them complete themselves.
  Time depends on your environment,...  Could be 10 days,....or 20 + days, for a qt jar. 
  ~Malabar   :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fattrout on August 03, 2009, 05:00:06 PM
MT, those are tough questions.
1st, this is what i do. when the jars are 1/2 way or more, i will lightly roll the jars around in my hand to loosen up the grain. i never shake the jar more then is needed to loosen the grain up.. if you shake the jars to hard, you will bruise the shit out of it. with time you will get an eye for it. :mellow:
2nd, it can take 2 to 4 weeks to fully colonize. -_-
good luck, fattrout
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: MT on August 03, 2009, 05:36:27 PM
Thanks for the input everyone. I will continue to update as my experiment progresses.
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: MT on August 03, 2009, 07:48:39 PM
malabar, do you think I may have used too much spore solution?
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 03, 2009, 07:59:42 PM
MT,
  I can't tell you how much solution is too much.  Personally, I Never use more than 1cc/qt, and much less w/pts.  I suppose I could use more, but I have excellent results, and have learned that the grains, millet, seeds, and oats don't really need much if you hit the jar correctly.
  And, it's not a matter of running out, because I make LC, and have learned to extend or multiply 10cc x 10 fold.  So I guess it's a matter of what you feel comfortable with. 
  With time you will see just how much you really need to get the job done, and p/u other avenues, such as G2G, with eliminates at least a week of waiting, and the need for constantly purchasing spores syringes so frequently.
  Next quart, why not try 1/2 the amount?  1cc  If you have the same results, you can go from there, and may not really need that much either,..
  ~Malabar   :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fattrout on August 03, 2009, 08:06:52 PM
MT, its not that you use to much. you just don't need that much. but its not goin to hurt, if anything the jars will colonize faster. i'm sure thats what he meant... :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fattrout on August 03, 2009, 08:08:29 PM
sorry malabar, you beat me to it... :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 03, 2009, 08:11:31 PM
Fattrout,
  Thx.  Sorry to step on toes there,...     -_-    At least we stay on the same page.  lol
  I figure 10cc,..  Hell that's like 15 qts, and at least a dozen pts!   
  ~Malabar   :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fattrout on August 03, 2009, 08:37:20 PM
yep i agree, same page. BTW malabar, (wheeler ranch) WOW you were there at the beginning!! i was barley a teenager and living in grass valley at the time. but i remember all that shit.....

P.S. MT, sorry for treadding on your thread.  :rolleyes:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 03, 2009, 08:43:29 PM
   Alright, Fattrout,......
    Don't you start that trying to make me "feel" old, Shit!  lol  It just won't work,......       -_-
  ~Malabar   :mellow:

    My Kung-Fu may suck,....    But my Shrooms kick ASS!
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fattrout on August 03, 2009, 08:49:06 PM
o.k. malabar, lol.. hey, i do remember some good party's in them hills!! :ph34r:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 03, 2009, 08:54:42 PM
  For sure there was,.....  Life is still Good!  Just a bit harder, and we wear more clothes,.....  In public.
    :ph34r:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: MT on August 03, 2009, 11:16:13 PM
Thanks, I was just concerned that I may have added too much moisture with the 2cc's. Now that I know I can use less I will experiment with a smaller amount.
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: dub504 on August 04, 2009, 02:25:39 PM
It only takes one spore to germinate and start the whole process. Albeit that would be really slow.
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: coyoteyogi on August 06, 2009, 04:57:04 AM
Don't quote me but, I think it takes two spores. ^_^
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 06, 2009, 07:06:08 AM
   One Spore, Two Spores,......  For Damn sure it doesn't take 2cc's!   :huh:
      ~Malabar    :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fungiguy on August 06, 2009, 08:49:03 AM
hey malabar!!! i've been using popcorn to grow on and so far-so good. I like that it colonizes very quickly. the g2g is easy and fast. that being said, i am going to once again diversify. this time with wbs. i read a few good teks on it. do you have any advice?? i know you are strictly a grain guy, so i thought who better to ask.
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 06, 2009, 09:07:10 AM
Fungiguy,
  Good to hear that you are broadening your horizons!  It's always good to at least have reached out and touched based with other substrates. 
  I agree on the rate of colonization of popcorn, but you may find the WBS can colonize even faster.  I have tried the popcorn, and feel it is easy and convenient to use for the g2g, though I wasn't too very impressed with the size or yield of the fruits on the corn.  With 5 different strains, side by side with grain yields, I was Very disappointed.  Such is life.
   The only advice I could probably provide not knowing what you are seeking would be to soak your seeds well, unless you are Very sure of your source.  And then it couldn't hurt to soak anyway.
  Though I haven't used WBS in a while but, I still do use Millet.  Sometimes I mix this with the grains to accelerate the colonization. 
  So if you are comfortable with your corn tek, you can skip a step, transfer from the corn to your WBS, and be that much further ahead.  Other than that, once you have gotten beyond that BRF stage, most TEKs are almost the same. 
  If you have something more specific, feel free to ask.  If I can help,..  I'm there for you, as are your other friends here.  Fattrout has done a bit of WBS if I'm not mistaken as well, so when he pops in, he may some suggestions for you, and PW may have a few for you also.
  Enjoy.
    ~Malabar   :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fungiguy on August 06, 2009, 09:18:11 AM
cool, thanks malabar. i am gonna prep the wbs just like popcorn. 24 hour soak, 60 minute simmer, 90 minutes in pressure cooker. than g2g, incubate, and case. what do you think??
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fungiguy on August 06, 2009, 09:27:09 AM
btw, what is millet?
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 06, 2009, 09:40:25 AM
Fungiguy,
  Your course of action sounds like a solid plan.    -_-    Go with it,... 
As for millet.  It's a light grain, but also sold as a treat for caged and outdoor birds.  They sell bags of it in Walmart, made by Hartz , 3lbs/$3.00 , or you can spend too much at the health food store.  It's sold as cereal there.  I just shuck it off of the little branches, and throw it into the jars, with or w/o other grains.  In a g2g, the Millet takes off and is done in 3 or 4 days.  Great for speeding things along, or spawning to coir/compost.
  ~Malabar   :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fungiguy on August 06, 2009, 10:05:24 AM
what do you think about millet/wbs, 50/50?? sounds like the millet would speed up the already fast wbs.
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 06, 2009, 10:40:27 AM
Fungiguy,
  I am sure you could add millet to the WBS, but I am sure there is already a percentage of millet mixed in.  I could be wrong, so check the ingredients.  Increasing the balance can't hurt you, but why waste cash?
   :ph34r:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fungiguy on August 06, 2009, 10:59:17 AM
on my way to the store. i'll let you know what the verdict is.
                       -peace, love, and soul!!!!!
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 06, 2009, 11:03:02 AM
  Cool enough,....  Happy shopping!
     
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: dub504 on August 06, 2009, 02:14:57 PM
I've been playing around w/ WBS and Millet each on their own and mixing them for shits and giggles. WBS does have a couple of different kinds of millet in it. I have to refrain what Malabar is saying. You really need to soak the WBS to get those nasty little endospores to germinate, so you can kill them when you sterilize. I seem to have more problems w/ WBS than just Millet.


Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: MT on August 06, 2009, 03:47:25 PM
The WBS that I bought at Wal-mart had millet mixed in. Ten pound bag for seven bucks. I rinsed and drained the grain several times with hot water until the water was clear, soaked it in hot water for four hours and then simmered for twenty minutes.
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 06, 2009, 04:08:01 PM
MT,
  I am guessing you did okay,.....  What strain did you hit it with?  And, perhaps  if you had a good level of success, you and Dub can shoot Fungiguy some pointers, or higher points of your experience if he decides to move forward with the WBS.
  ~Malabar    :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: MT on August 06, 2009, 04:14:42 PM
A liquid spore syringe with Texas strain, and apparently i used way more than I needed per jar. Oh well, live and learn after all that's what we are here for. I know I have personally gained a wealth of knowlodge from this forum. Having the opportunity to ask questions of those who have already made the journey makes things much easier.
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 06, 2009, 04:34:17 PM
MT,
  Very cool.  It's learning and sharing which keeps this forum moving forward. 
      Keep the wheels turning,...
   ~Malabar   :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: MT on August 14, 2009, 06:25:58 PM
My quart jars are colonizing quite rapidly. I can certainly see where I could have used way less spore solution. One jar is about 80% colonized and the other five are getting close to 50% or better after 17 days.
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 14, 2009, 06:46:48 PM
MT,
    You are looking Great!   :ph34r:  But, as usual,.....  I'm Trippin'  Bawlz!
  But, seriously,....  I would be thinking g2g very soon.  Keep the dreams alive,..   -_- 
  Gotta go now,......  22g dried, and I think it's time to watch the waves and stars here at the beach.
        Life is Great!     :rolleyes:   Run with it and Enjoy!
  ~Malabar    :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: coyoteyogi on August 15, 2009, 05:35:02 AM
22g dried, and I think it's time to watch the waves and stars
Holy Crap Batman. How can you even type?
Happy Trails...
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 15, 2009, 06:04:05 AM
  Trust me,......  It was a Very interesting evening.   -_-  And the stars over Florida were bright and alive for sure last night! 
    :ph34r:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fattrout on August 15, 2009, 06:35:41 AM
malabar, nice to hear you had a interesting evening. i know if i ate 22gs, i'd be on my back on the beach all nite...  :ph34r:
btw, i bet those waves were intense!!!!  :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fungiguy on August 16, 2009, 07:07:15 AM
WOW. 22 grams!!! i thougt i was a radical taking 6 to 8 grams. most of the time i take 4 grams. but when the time is right, i'm gonna try 10 grams. you know, time of day, setting, and of course where my head is. everything has to be in line. tip of the hat malabar :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 16, 2009, 08:08:06 AM
Fungiguy,
  Trust me,...  It took most of yesterday to find My hat,.....  so thanks for tipping yours for me!    ^_^
  ~Malabar   :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: fattrout on August 16, 2009, 08:24:57 AM
 i did the last nite, a total of 10gs. it was in incredible... :ph34r: that was the most i have done at one time.. :mellow: 3 weeks from now the wife, i , one of my sons and his girlfriend are goin camping.. i'm goin to try 15gs... :ph34r:
my son and his girlfriend have never taken the magic fruit before. they want me introduce them. this should be fun, they are both 24 years old... ^_^ don't worry i'll go easy on them... :wacko:
sorry for rambling, fattrout
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 16, 2009, 08:30:24 AM
Fattrout,
  It's all good,.....   ^_^   Glad to hear of the adventure, and I'm sure in the proper environment, you and yours will all have a spectacular time!    :ph34r:
  And by all means, be gentle on them the first time out.  We will want them to come back and visit sometime!  lol
  ~Malabar   :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: MT on August 18, 2009, 05:50:16 PM
22 grams! malabar you madcap.
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: MT on August 19, 2009, 04:21:38 PM
Sunday my quart jars looked to be approx 80% colonized so I took them out to the garage and smacked them around on a tire quite a few times to break up the colonized grain. I shook them vigorously and then returned them to my incubator. This morning I checked on them and every jar was completely colonized and looked like a jar of fluffy white insulation. I shook up four of the jars and cased them in 9x13 aluminum pans using a fifty fifty mix of peat and verm, covered the pans with foil and returned them to the darkness. So far so good.
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: malabar on August 19, 2009, 04:26:05 PM
MT,
  Sounds as though you are well on your way!   We'll be looking to see those beautiful little ones,......    ^_^
   ~Malabar   :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: shroomzer on August 22, 2009, 05:59:52 AM
 :mellow:  -- COOL MT ... i'm just bumpin' this thread back to the top of my page above all the spammers posts!!!
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: MT on August 25, 2009, 05:57:42 PM
I took my last colonized quart of WBS and did a G2G and made six new quarts yesterday morning. This afternoon before I came to work I looked at them and can already see signs of new growth. The speed of the process certainly appears to increase with the G2G TEK. Soon I will have to stop this madness or I will run out of room. I have already bought a second indoor green house I just need to make time to set it all up.
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: room408 on August 25, 2009, 07:54:28 PM
mt, i just knocked up 12 jars tonight with some rye grain. what kind of indoor greenhouse do you have? the marthas home garden? i cant wait until i have a place for room like that
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: MT on August 25, 2009, 11:10:04 PM
I bought the first one on line at a garden supply site. I can't remember the name though, just do a search. It is basically a metal frame with a plastic tent over it. About five feet tall x two and a half wide x one and a half deep with four wire shelves. The one I bought on line cost me about 45 bucks last winter, but I found one last week at a local drugstore for 15. Works great with an ultrasonic.
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: coyoteyogi on August 27, 2009, 03:36:55 AM
I think it may be time to start a new thread boys and girls. :mellow:
Title: Re: Moving on to grain.
Post by: MT on August 27, 2009, 04:11:53 PM
Yes, perhaps this has gone on long enough.